COPY2DVD and NEC 3520A drive....

amichael · Newbie Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 5

Things have gone a bit weird ever since I have upgraded to a my new NEC ND-3520A DL drive from Pioneer 105. I have upgraded to the latest copy2dvd version 3.045.79. Most of the SL DVD's I have burned in the past incl new ones using the NEC drive have problems being ripped using dvd decypter. The DVD's are fine as they play perfectly on my Sony Home DVD player (lens is the most sensitive and has no error correction, so any problems would show up !) I have upgraded the firmware on the NEC drive, but has not improved anything. Everything does point to the Drive itself, but one thing I have noticed with the copy2dvd software is that it is still writing at 4 speed. I am using 8 speed disks and using Nero wrtes them at 8 speed AND also they read very very fast using dvd decrypter. I have tried setting the speed for writes to MAX and 8x with no luck. The DVD burned using copy2dvd software on the NEC drive burms at 4 speed and reads a 2-4 speed and at most times it fails with sector reads. The DVD's burned using nero at either 4 speed or 8 speed disks are read by dvd decrypter at blistering fast speeds !!! Does not make sense. This is the extract from dvd decypter:- _NEC DVD_RW ND-3520A 1.U7 (ATA) Current Profile: DVD-R Disc Information: Status: Empty Erasable: No Free Sectors: 2,298,496 Free Space: 4,707,319,808 bytes Free Time: 510:48:46 (MM:SS:FF) Supported Write Speeds: 2x, 4x, 6x, 8x, 12x Pre-recorded Information: Manufacturer ID: CMC MAG. AE1 Physical Format Information (Last Recorded): Disc ID: !-00 Book Type: DVD-R Part Version: 5 Disc Size: 120mm Maximum Read Rate: Not Specified Number of Layers: 1 Track Path: Parallel Track Path (PTP) Linear Density: 0.267 um/bit Track Density: 0.74 um/track First Physical Sector of Data Area: 196,608 Last Physical Sector of Data Area: 2,495,103 Last Physical Sector in Layer 0: 0

SirQUK · Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 12:41 pm Post subject:

Hi amichael Welcome to our forums I see you are using liggy and dees fine firmware! What brand of CMC are you using? These normally burn fine at 8x unless you get a bad batch. I'm sure the VSO team will be most interested in your report. Can you do me a favour and use cdspeed to run a transfer test on the media from both software and tell me speed it reports for the transfer. Does the one recorded on nero transfer any better than the one on copytodvd. Thankyou for reporting this!

amichael · Newbie Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 5

After checking and re-checking I found the problem to be either the firmware itself - although I doubt it as many seem to be ok or the way I apdated it. I did it though windows xp nad nero info tool showed the drive as having a max speed of 5 !! Anyway, to cut a long story short I used 1.25 dangerous bros. firmware and all seems OK. Although I would still say the NEC drive is far more picky at it's reading speeds depending on the media quality - others seem to manage it well, why can't NEC ?

SirQUK · Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 9:10 pm Post subject:

The NEC 3520 for sure has issues near the end of the disc if jitter suddenly rises rather than gradually increases. Although this seems a downside at first it is a good test for your recorded media. If the writers records a disc at any speed and the transfer doesn't slow down on the NEC 3520 you can be sure of having a very well balanced, low jitter recording. Often overspeeded media may contain higher jitter than the rated speed one near the end of a disc or at a speed jump. This is not to say it is bad amounts of jitter all the time but because the NEC 3520 reads at such high speeds it will see any problems a lower speed read would not show. If you slow your read speed down to 12x ( actually 13x cav), then you will not see this slowdown that you might at 16x. Not all readers allow 16x reading so the transfers in them may seem better although i will say the NEC 3500 can transfer some DVDs no problem that the NEC 3520 can struggle on - this just shows the 3520 may be set a little more sensivetively than the 3500. Hope this helps

amichael · Newbie Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 5

I have just ripped 3 movies with the 1.u7 firmware with these times:- 1.Lord Of The Rings - 2 towers (7.45gb) Av. 5.0x Max 7.3x Time 18:13 2. Gladiator (6.8gb) Av. 4.9x Max 6.9x Time 17:47 3. 5th Element - Superbit (6.85gb) Av 4.8x Max 6.9x Time 18:02 They are roughly about the same speeds to read DL disks I then read a disk I burned on my old Pioneer 105 using the cheapest (16p each) dvd-r - BulkPaq x4 (princo brand). Size 3.77gb Av. 9.0x Max 14.4x Time 5:19 I've even read some that went upto 16x max speeds. Surely there must be a firmware trick to increase this DL speed, or is it purely down to the hardware ? I then updated the firmware back to 1.25 and got the exact same read speeds on the DL disks, but I got better results on Bulkpaq DVD-r read:- Av 9.7x Max 14.5x Time 4:53 Strange ? Does anyone have the new Pioneer 109 (flashed !) that can do a similar test on any of the DL layer retail disks above to see how fast they can be read ?

SirQUK · Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 11:41 pm Post subject:

@Amichael You are actually getting very fast rip times for your dual layer dvd on the NEC.. By default it is set to 2x read for D/L. For S/L you will get 16x only at the very end of the disc due to the NECS CAV reading method ( still very fast at about 5 mins per disc for a full S/L disc ) Plextors can read D/L at 12x

amichael · Newbie Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 5

Both firmware versions I have mentioned 1.U7 and 1.25 have the rip speed unlocked - I just tried 2 different upgrade firmware versions. I think the original firmware of the NEC was 1.04 and the read speed is locked down to what you said.

SirQUK · Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 5:00 pm Post subject:

Yes by default the 1.04 f/w is speed locked

amichael · Newbie Joined: 09 Mar 2005 Posts: 5

OK then. I have got my new Pioneer 109 and here are some of my thoughts and actions so far. I have patched my drive to become the retail A09 version. This is currently the only way to remove the rip lock from the original 109 drive. I ripped Gladiator and got these results Av. 7.9x Max 11.8x Time 10:56 That's an impressive quicker time of 7 minutes over the NEC. But I look at it as a 70% approx INCREASE in read speed over the 3520A. The read speed of a single layer dvd (4.36GB) was Av 8.2 Max 11.6 Time: 6:43 So it seems a single layer rips with the same speed of a dual layer. In this case the NEC is marginally faster. So depending on what you are more likely to be doing may help you decide. There is currently no firmware available to unlock the region coding of the 109 - so here is a problem. We wait to see what happens. Effectively my drive is now classwed as the A09 and any firmware upgrades will have to be on that model. Another point of interest I prefer the NEC open/close draw mechanism. The Pioneer just sounds and feels very raw !! if you know what I mean. Or should I say the NEC's mechanism seems more refined. I will not be burning any DL DVD's - simply put they are just too expensive at about £5 each. I would rather use 2 SL disks at about 50p for the 2 !!!! Also bear in mind the time taken to burn a dual layer disk would be about the same as doing it on 2 seperate SL DVD's !!

SirQUK · Posted: Fri Mar 18, 2005 3:30 pm Post subject:

Thanks for your early thoughts amichael. The NEC has always been slow at D/L reading (shame). You are right that D/L is indeed not very cost effective at this present time but it will drop within the next 6-8 weeks I am informed - by how much I don't know. The lack of a current RPC patch for the 109 is a worry for Pioneer owners who want the extra Ripping speed but I'm sure it will come for the OEM versions soon.

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